Sales Transformation

Alright, welcome back to another episode of Sales Transformation brought

to you by Ledium. I'm your host, Collin Mitchell, and we've got Alan Zo back

on the show. He's the co-founder of Warmly. The last

time we had Alan on, we talked a little bit about all of

the pivots that Warmly has made and the

story behind what has made Warmly

go in the direction that they are with this idea of warm outbound. And

today we're going to dig a little bit deeper into revenue orchestration and what

Yeah. For anybody who missed the first episode that we had you on, do

you want to give us just a little bit of background on yourself and then we'll dig into today's

Yep. So I was, I'm one of the co-founders. I started off

as one of the engineers and then became CTO and

moved around a lot internally within the company in various roles from sales,

And, uh, The last time we had you

on, we talked about this problem that you guys have taken

on to solve where you actually worked within Warmly as

an SDR. And the biggest problem that

you found was when it was the right time to

engage with prospects. And so today

we're going to talk a little bit about revenue orchestration. First

Awesome. Yeah. So revenue orchestration. The

whole idea behind this is that in order to

properly execute some of these signal-based intent outbound

or sales or marketing efforts, and a lot of this comes from account-based marketing, is

right time, right message, right channel, right person. You

need many things happening simultaneously at once to be done

effectively. because the average buyer's headspan is like a

Gartner statistic out there, especially for someone viewing a

web page is like eight seconds. You got like eight seconds to make an impression with your

website and then they're gone. So how can a rep, you

know, research that person, that account, understand

the context behind it in the CRM, and then reach out with the right message

all inside of eight seconds? It's not possible. And then simultaneously calculating

that one person parallelized because there's, you know,

maybe 10, 20, 100 people on your site simultaneously as well. And

so it's a big expectation, but at the same time, I think about in terms of brick

and mortar stores as well, because when you walk into a brick and mortar store and

you have a question about like one of the items, but no one's there

to answer. And instead you get a call like a week later, like,

Oh, you had this question about this one shirt. Here's, here's, here's the

deal with it. It's already too late, way too late. And

that analogy can be applied to B2B SaaS, can be applied to software sales,

That's right. Bought it from the store across the street who

Yeah, yeah. So, I

mean, the interesting thing here is, you

know, this really helps sales

and marketing be more aligned with a common goal, right?

Because marketing's spending a lot of time, energy, money,

sweat, blood, whatever, to get people to the site, right?

And once they get to the site and they convert, whatever that looks like, you

know, it's sales job to get them to the finish line. So

this is really helping solve, you

Totally. I love this because And warmly over

here, we're of the opinion that obviously after 2020, much

of marketing and sales and the strategy that worked in the past, pre-2020, doesn't

work anymore. It's changing. So like cold is getting more difficult. And

of course, this is a very hotly debated topic. People might

be switching over to something more like warm. Sequences, targeting,

paid, all these things are getting a lot harder. But at the

end of the day, when someone is thinking about you or they're introduced to

your product or your company or your brand, One of the first things they're going to do

is they're going to visit your website. And so marketing's job, like

I've started to learn this as well more and more, is that it's to raise awareness, get people to

understand your brand, have a good positive impression of your

brand. What is brand to me? Brand is actually reputation. So the

moment that we bring people to the site is

when the roles and the

integration between marketing and sales has to be really tight. They come to the website. And

then the next thing that happens is we need to convert them from the website. And that's also

part of marketing's job. But this is where it starts to blend because with a tool that

allows you to chat with the person who's on the site and then convert that

into a sales conversation, that's where you're sort of really aligning marketing

and sales efforts together. Converting website traffic. And that's one of the things

Yeah. And I think that the, you know, with more

and more teams realizing that it's not about

quantity anymore, right? It's about quality, good

engagement with the right prospects at the right time. And, you

know, everybody understands this, that, you know, sending thousands

of emails and, you know, getting, you know, less than 5% conversion,

it just doesn't work. Or

hiring a bunch of SDRs and putting them on the phone and smile and

dial is not an effective strategy. And

the challenge that I think a lot of people are having at least when I'm talking with leaders with

outbound is that there's just way

more competition for your prospect's attention, right? Everybody's inbox

is full with stuff that they don't read, so even if you

have a great product, you're solving a real problem, and

you actually took the time to write a well-crafted, personalized message,

maybe even one-to-one, like not even a sequence, the

chances that it gets read are pretty slim. I

see at least on outbound, phone has the highest conversion, but

Why not have a way to reach the right people

That's right. Yeah, no, it's absolutely true. It is getting a

lot harder. It's hard to distinguish what are the positive signals,

but, you know, one of the, I come back to this again,

the website is the central choke point for all

of your marketing and sales outbound efforts. All that stuff will

eventually lead back to the website. And the fact that

they're on your website, and if you knew how they got there, like they

came from a podcast and knew that was a high converted channel, or they came

from paid, then you could do something about that. And

so, yes, this whole idea of like signal based selling, signal

based. Brian Hamer from gmail.com is active on the website. That's

hilarious. That's actually our product telling us that someone is on our website. You

tells you when one of your accounts that you own is on the website. And there it is. That's exactly

right. So if I responded back, maybe that person would have had a

The interesting thing that I think most people don't realize is, even

though let's say you're doing cold outbound, Most people are going to come to your website

before they reply to your email, right? They're going to check out if

they want to reply, right? They're not going to just, hey, you wrote a clever email

and I'm going to reply to you. Typically, they're going to take that domain. They're

going to look at your website. They might look real quick and

decide, is this something I'm interested in or not? And

so with something like this, you now have the ability to see, hey, I sent Alan

a cold email, maybe three cold emails. On the third

one, he actually opened it. Now he's on our site and he's on the pricing page.

So what is

Yeah, that's a great point. I mean, some of the signals that we also integrate

with it isn't just the website, but it's also a third party intent, like

Bombora, to see what research topics they have. So you're trying to gather

as much information as possible on the prospect and create the right

triggers, like the combination of triggers. And so you can create

these things like this, that not only are they on the pricing page,

but this is their fifth time on the pricing page. and their target account

from their account list. And their research topic indicates that they're hot for

your product because they were searching for these key topics in

the past seven days. And on top of that, three

other people from their company also visit the site. So once all these conditions are met, then

notify the rep. And again, it's at least personal

opinion here, but if you have the timing right and you have the

person right, what you say actually matters a lot less. So

it's really distinguishing. The timing and the person, these

two can operate on their own. And then you can just say, Hey, what's up? And

they are more likely to respond to you just from a, Hey, what's up? The timing is right. Then

if you concocted something crazy and like, Oh, I saw you came in from

Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and what to say is usually the thing

that people struggle with the most. Right. Um, which

That's right, yeah. We found it to be

very simple. If someone is hungry, like I like this analogy that

when you're going out drinking at a bar and it's 2 a.m. and

you're hungry and you walk outside the bar and there's a hot dog stand, I

mean, that hot dog stand is going to sell out. The fact that that hot dog stand is there doesn't

matter. But any other time during the day, it wouldn't get my

business. But just at 2 a.m. at that precise time. He

didn't need to say anything. I didn't need to. It's just mutual understanding that I'm

going to buy that hot dog. And that's kind of what it's at least how I see it. When

someone visits the site and they have high intent to have

Yeah. And the interesting thing is you might not even like hot dogs, but

you're eating one and you probably paid top dollar for

Yeah, inebriated, you know,

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